tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post6628413477403369003..comments2024-02-16T07:42:10.015-06:00Comments on SKEPTIC REFLECTIONS: A MATTER OF CHOICEJOHN PHILLIPShttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06357524637192990158noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post-86289022360170023752013-08-28T11:37:13.221-05:002013-08-28T11:37:13.221-05:00I guess I have the same general reply to this as I...I guess I have the same general reply to this as I have stated above and elsewhere. My goal here is to express myself regarding a number of topics, in this instance the question of freedom of choice. And I am most interested in opinions either in support of my perspective or in opposition. I am hopeful that others will comment. But it was not my intent to turn this into an open forum on religious beliefs. I look forward to your comments, but I ask that you respect my goals. JOHN PHILLIPShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06357524637192990158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post-51702648231797007672013-08-28T11:32:00.166-05:002013-08-28T11:32:00.166-05:00Frankly, Lisa, I really do not know how to follow ...Frankly, Lisa, I really do not know how to follow the point of your comments, even after having read them a number of times. You speak of living each day in the now, free to act in love rather than fear--noble sentiments, but I'm not sure I understand the point. Then you speak of living under the terms of an enemy. Not sure what that means. Then you state that you choose God's kingdom "because His kingdom makes sense because it's based on His character of love, and begin acting in love towards others as He does. Nothing else makes sense....it is the moment of awakening, when a person is set free." I simply cannot follow what you are saying here. My denseness again? The next few paragraphs are, frankly, Christian rhetoric the relationship of which to the topic of Choice escapes me, I'm afraid.<br /><br />As I have said elsewhere, I am very much looking for comments on the topics I am trying to address in my blog. In this case the topic is choice and whether we have it. If you believe in freedom of choice, for example, I would invite you--or anyone else who might be interested--to address why you believe choice does exist. I guess I am asking that you go back, reread my original post, and explain why you agree or disagree with what I have written. Simply to state some Christian beliefs does not really address the question in my humble opinion.<br /><br />One comment on the topic of abortion: I really hope to stay away from topics that I think have a strong political component, such as abortion, gun control, gay rights, etc.JOHN PHILLIPShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06357524637192990158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post-13958846707876922002013-08-27T10:29:45.813-05:002013-08-27T10:29:45.813-05:00As far as the Bible is concerned you can't pic...As far as the Bible is concerned you can't pick and choose. It is story of the progression of sin, of man's understanding of God and realizing we are so blind..see so little of what He is like, because of the darkness of our minds. Even the very person of Jesus in living flesh convinced very few that His ways were better. But it is also revelation of God, written by men who were trying to leave a record of their experience with God. And it seems to show two pictures, one of an arbitrary, wrathful vengeful God that will get you in the end. One that says I love you, but if you don't obey me I will kill you. Many terrible things happened to the people of God...much was blamed on God...but what would the world have been like if Eve hadn't believed the lies of satan and lived in fellowship with God...there would be no wars, or sickness of death...we live here held captive by evil. God operates on freedom...and therefore He doesn't force. Mankind lived according to their own willful desires, God kept trying to help...look here are Ten useful rules...if you live by them you will have peace and happiness...they represent His character, living other centered love. But the consequences of living outside of these rules are chaos...it's self evident...look at the world around us, even in individual lives. We marry and pledge to love one another and stay true...and yet what is one of the first things to destroy marriage...infidelity. We as a human race were unfaithful to God...an we suffer the consequences, not because He imposes them but because we no long trust Him. Jesus objective was to bring trust back. His death was the extreme example of giving self to show us how trustworthy He was...we could kill our Creator and He would forgive us. What's not to love?<br /> <br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17878921756248563809noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post-59488131511144652392013-08-27T10:28:23.826-05:002013-08-27T10:28:23.826-05:00No I don't mean that I can avoid the chaos of ...No I don't mean that I can avoid the chaos of this world, but I can live above it. Accept that I am frail and dying and understand why I am this way and yet with the trust and promise that there is more. And yet live each day in the now, being free to act in love rather than in fear. We are certainly living under the terms of an enemy. It's like the government of a given country...we must respect those arbitrary rules that are imposed on us. Like Jesus said render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's and unto God the things that are His. All we can give God is me...I make that choice because His kingdom makes sense because it's based on His character of love, and begin acting in love towards others as He does. Nothing else makes sense....it is the moment of awakening, when a person is set free.<br /> It's like a prisoner of war...the walls may contain the body, but the mind is free to wander. It's hope, based on knowledge and trust that they will come for me and will set me free.<br /><br /> Jesus said he came to set us free, he broke the hold of evil with His death because He knew no evil. He lived above evil. He lived doing the will of God because He knew beyond the shadow of a doubt this was the way to live in peace and happiness and He never used the methods of this world. His death was at the hands of evil (not the hand of God...no appeasement necessary) broke the hold of death. He was the key that unlocked Death door. Death came about as a result of being separated from God. Death had no hold on Him. He never bought into satan's temptations to put self above others, remember the lies Eve believed...you shall not die, and you will be like God. But was soon as she fell for those lies she lost peace and truth and gained fear...survival of the fittest mentality began here.<br /><br />So desiring to be like Him I open my being to this Godly influence. Not because of fear of punishment for not obeying a set of rules, but understanding that this is the way life was meant to operate and I agree with God's ways. <br /><br />Abortion is just an example of how far humanity has gone in the opposite direction of valuing the lives of others...Iike Herod killing all the baby boys at Jesus birth because there might be one among them that could be a treat to his throne....self preservation is paramount in the minds of the world. If children are an inconvenience, then just abort...it's such a good example of the irrisponsibility of the human race...we destroy ourselves. The world has gone so far from how life was meant to be lived.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /> <br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17878921756248563809noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post-87795068716142036982013-08-27T07:29:47.888-05:002013-08-27T07:29:47.888-05:00Lisa, I just am not clear what your first paragrap...Lisa, I just am not clear what your first paragraph means. Are you saying that you can choose freedom and if you do then you can avoid disease, accidents, crime, lies, deceptions, and death? Clearly that cannot be correct. We are all subject to those things whether we claim freedom or not.<br /><br />In the second paragraph you quote Christ. I'm not sure how this relates to the question of whether we have freedom of choice. In all honesty . . . and this is going to be very difficult, because it goes to the very heart of the Christian faith . . . the idea of Christ's sacrifice by dying on the cross to save mankind simply doesn't make any sense to me. It's one thing for a father to take on a more difficult job to better provide for his family. That's a rational choice, a calculated risk, and a recognition of his love for his family. But Christ dying on the cross to save mankind does not have that sort of obvious logic. There was no necessity for God to set up such a scenario and there is no logical causal relationship between a man dying and the salvation of mankind. If you choose to respond to this please do not do so simply by stating that it was done out of love or was the greatest sacrifice, etc. That is the sort of response I usually get and it just makes me more frustrated because it is not really an answer at all. I am looking for a rationale for God choosing this particular "test." I am sure you are aware that most of the world (that is, the nonChristian world) is as puzzled by this belief as I am. If one came upon this story without any preconceptions, that is as a nonChristian, it would seem much more rational to believe that this was an interpretation created by the followers after Christ's death to justify their faith in him. I would direct you to a book by Leon Festinger, When Prophesy Fails, which covers this sort of phenomenon from a psychological point of view.<br /><br />Lisa, could you explain how your comments about abortion relate to the question of whether we have freedom of choice? I do not see the connection.<br /><br />In your penultimate paragraph you quote scripture as evidence in support of freedom of choice, although, to be honest, I do not see how the verses you quote support the idea of freedom. But more importantly, in other comments you have expressed doubt that all scripture is inerrant. So how does one know which sections of the Bible are true and others simply the product of men and therefore not to be relied on? Is it a question of which coincide with your point of view? I guess I am asking for your direct response to this question also.<br /><br />I'm enjoying our dialogue. I would only ask that you respond to my questions. Thanks.<br /><br />JohnJOHN PHILLIPShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06357524637192990158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post-69585023645808524672013-08-27T00:23:22.075-05:002013-08-27T00:23:22.075-05:00Freedom is optional...it's a choice, an accept...Freedom is optional...it's a choice, an acceptance of the gift. We, I believe, are all slaves to the dictates of sin, evil, consequences, whatever you want to call it. Even if we live good lives, we are still affected by what is all around us. Death being the worst, and all else leading to death...disease, accidents, crime, lies, deceptions, are the fate you accept, the outcome of existence. I reject that. <br /><br />In John 10:10 Jesus says, "the thief comes to steal, kill and destroy, but I come that you may have life and have it more abundantly." At the end of that chapter He says to the leaders of his day, "I do the works of my Father, so if you don't believe me, believe my works." ( not exact quotes, but close) I find that as I look at the life of Jesus there isn't a being more loving and giving and kind to the point of being willing to die and forgiving those who killed Him in the process. This is what we were meant to be, filled with that love...to be restored back to this condition is possible through His love which by letting that inner space be filled with His Spirit...the I am...I am transformed into newness of life. I don't know how to explain it better. <br /><br />I think that Tolle sees this as a escape from the ego which is always trying to insure the it is first and tries to control everything by thoughts, worrying what will come creating fear and desire to protect self. Self preservation, extend existence is the passion of the world. Give the world a pill to stay young and people would sell everything to own it. We live in a world of materialism wanting more and never being satisfied and always looks for the next high. It controls the collective mind. I rarely watch Mtv awards but I did some Sunday...where has sanity gone in this generation? <br /><br />How many lives are lost to abortions ... for the helpless and poor life is valueless to the world. I hope there is more than meets the eye here on earth. Jesus said when we walk in darkness it is because the Light is not in Him...John 11:10 And He proclaimed Himself the Light of the World. <br /><br />11 Corinthians 4...We won't lose heart, we walk in truth, and commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God. And even if our Gospel is veiled it is veiled ( not understood) to those who are perishing. v4) In that case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that they might not see the light of the Gospel of the Glory (love) of God....for God said Light shall shine out of darkness, is the One who has shone in our heart to give light of the knowledge of the Glory of God in the face of Jesus. We have this treasure in earthly vessels (our bodies) that the surpassing greatness of the power may be of God and not ourselves."<br />And because that is my conviction I believe in Life understanding that freedom is hard to grasp for those without that belief. Sorry about quoting the Bible...not proof as you understand it, but to me it points to the truth which is Jesus. <br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17878921756248563809noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post-59280933653048904352013-08-26T15:03:05.203-05:002013-08-26T15:03:05.203-05:00OK, there's a lot going on in this comment.
...OK, there's a lot going on in this comment. <br /><br />First, by consciousness I mean simply those things such as a visual field, dreams, an inner monologue, etc. It seems incontestable that consciousness exists. The question is whether it makes any difference, and i would argue that it does not.<br /><br />I read some Eckhart Tolle a few years ago and have to confess that I didn't get much out of what he said. I think it is because he tends to speak in abstractions that are susceptible of multiple interpretations and are not necessarily grounded in traditional science. I just didn't get what he was saying, frankly, even though I tried.<br /><br />I, of course, do not believe in freedom of choice. That is the point of this post, and I am hoping that my language is clear enough at least to provide an understanding of my rationale for that point of view. I have to confess that I simply don't know what you meant by the statement, "Freedom is only available to those who accept it."JOHN PHILLIPShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06357524637192990158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7251693339364322895.post-84968189244882490732013-08-26T02:55:09.973-05:002013-08-26T02:55:09.973-05:00Big questions...you have talked about free will an... Big questions...you have talked about free will and consciousness...acknowledging we are conscious, but without free will. Then you have to define conscious. Do you mean being awakened to an inner state of being, like Eckhart Tolle talks about it, or just responding and reacting to life as it happens? I think many react without thought or reason. But I think there is an awakening process and a level that is above the rest..some call it transcendence. What I do when I am not "awake" and what I do when I am in an awakened state are different. I know this is true. I become aware of my surroundings and act, instead of reacting...often in a negative way. When I am "awake" I respond more thoughtfully. It's hard to explain what I mean unless you have experienced it. I would say that until that level of awareness is reached we mostly act on impulse without free will. I actually think much of humanity lives that way. Freedom is only available to those who accept it. It's a gift. It's becoming one with life. It's a connection beyond the body or within the inner space of the body.Our bodies get old and decay, but this sense of being is the life that animates the form.The temple that houses this Oneness, but it isn't physical. It's the energy. Have you ever asked yourself, "why did I do that?" Who is asking that question? The real you is asking that question. It's the awareness behind the thoughts. What happens to us is never really the problem it's the thoughts that we have about events that cause anxiety and stress. We aren't what we think, we are the being behind those thoughts. Becoming aware and letting this level of consciousness flow into what you do brings a focus to the present, living now...we live only in this moment in time...which really means time is irrelevant... Much of suffering is the result of people reacting, they have allowed their fears to take over. Rather than facing the facts ...like "I am ruined", which is a story verses "I have 50 cents in my pocket," which is a fact and lets you take effective action. This awareness allows for freedom, we are no longer controlled by the inner voice in our head. In Oneness there is no fear. Love casts out fear. This may not make any sense to you. It is just something I have grasps an understand of maybe 5 years ago...until then religion was just that...but now God is a Presence that when I practice this awareness, and sadly not often enough, has changed my life and given me freedom...Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17878921756248563809noreply@blogger.com